[MLB-WIRELESS] Fwd: [mesh] WOAH!

[destrkta]

All i have to say for the last 2 years i have been spending alot of money
off my own back to help others, my ftp server used to be online 24/7 no
ratio, the only requirement was that i had to know the person and trust
them. This all  changed when telstra threw in the 3gb and i can no longer
afford to offer my content. That's what wireless is about for me, i get my
own content via other means and make it easier for others to get it than
download it themselves, by the end of the year i shall have both a dedicated
gaming and ftp server ready to go up all i need is some more time to save.

This is roughly $5000 investment but i'm doing it not only for myself but
for others, i think alot of other people out there do the same, I realised
this as soon as i joined the fxping community every1 puts up alot of
time/money/effort to do the best for the team. And i believe that's the way
this is going.
----- Original Message -----
From: "KevinL" <darius at obsidian.com.au>
To: <sneeze at alphalink.com.au>
Cc: <melbwireless at wireless.org.au>
Sent: Tuesday, July 02, 2002 1:10 PM
Subject: Re: [MLB-WIRELESS] Fwd: [mesh] WOAH!


> On Tue, 2002-07-02 at 11:25, Ryan Abbenhuys wrote:
> > One more comment before I shutup on the issue...
> >
> > Are we expecting that Melbwireless will eventually change from being
just a
> > free network for anyone (which I thought was the philosophy that
everyone agreed
> > on? correct me if i'm wrong), to a company or non-profit company that
provides
> > wireless network infrastructure for ISP's and businesses?   WTF?
>
> $DEITY forbid we ever become that - it would be a truly horrible idea.
> But $DEITY forbid we also ever become something that places strictures
> on what can happen across the mesh akin to those apana used to apply
> (ie. "no commercial-nature traffic").  I think that would eventually be
> far too restrictive.
>
> I certainly don't want to see charges being levied for access to the
> network - but I _can_ realistically see individuals wanting to charge
> for their own content, be it bandwidth or other, over the mesh.
>
> "Free network for anyone" by it's nature means people are going to be
> doing things you don't like over the network.  Are you going to
> seriously stand by your statement, and protect everyone's right to do
> what they want over the mesh, even if it involves things you find
> odious?
>
> > Personally, I wouldn't like the idea of an individual/company/ISP paying
to
> > use the piece of the network that I've spent my free time setting up and
developing.
> > Taking away bandwidth that I could be using to copy Unreal Tournament
maps off
> > my mate.
> > I could turn off my AP at anytime, could move house, point my antenna a
different
> > way, basically anything to disrupt the service that they are paying for.
What
> > happens then?  Do they sue me? Do I get a couple of guys in suits on my
doorstep
> > asking me to please switch it back on?
>
> That is one of the biggest restrictions to anyone being likely to sell
> always-on, reliable access.  And it's a biggie, for sure.  But just
> because that problem exists, I don't personally think we should be
> saying "thou shalt not" to anything involving Internet, or paid-for
> services.
>
> The nicest example I can think of is my offering my broadband link up to
> other members of melb-wireless on a cost-recovery basis, perhaps if
> they've only got modem links or they've been disconnected or whatever.
> I'd like the freedom to do that - and I can't see how we can allow that
> and disallow other stuff.  It quickly turns into a board of people
> giving their seal of approval to what goes over the mesh, and I for one
> dislike that idea.
>
> I'll note, also, that even without paid stuff going on, people _are_
> going to flood your link with their traffic - if I decide to copy 10
> ISOs from a friend's place through your link, you've got problems right
> there.  We haven't even approached thinking about that yet, so take that
> as a problem not just for paid-for traffic, but for all traffic -
> congestion for the central nodes could be a big issue if/when the mesh
> gets large enough, regardless of what the traffic is.
>
> > What happens to Fred from down the street who was using my AP to link
into the
> > melbwireless network to then use PPPoE to access an internet connection
that
> > he was paying Bill for who had setup a little business to provide access
to
> > melbwireless members? What happens when he loses his link into the
network because
> > my AP blew up after a power surge, then Bill refuses to give him a
refund on
> > the internet access fee, then Frank starts prank calling my house at 3am
and
> > abusing my mother and throwing rocks at my car?
> >
> > Can someone tell me what I do now please?
>
> Call the cops?
>
> Same deal can happen without money, in all seriousness.
>
> I'm not suggesting that we get into the business of making money off the
network.
> I'm just suggesting that if people want to sell something over the mesh,
they be
> allowed to.  If people don't want to be involved in that, then they can
opt not to buy
> stuff over the mesh.  But if we're really building something that's free
for people
> to do what they want, then it has to be acknowledged that that's going to
include
> more than just the list of things you or I have thought of.  Internet
access, for
> me, is a natural pick.  So's VPN'ing to my own network, so's providing
localised
> content for places like Ceres (to steal someone else's idea ;).  But
that's by no
> means the full extent of what people are going to think of, I'm sure.
>
> Closing note for me:  If people want to sell Internet access over the
mesh, I
> think it'd be good to let them.  So long as everyone realises that the
mesh is
> inherently unstable, then people should be allowed to do what they like.
Anyone
> seriously looking for wireless bandwidth has enough "real" options in the
form of
> people like Alphalink (or others) anyway.
>
> KJL
>
>
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